Article

Ashamed To Share A Country…

By BlackSun / October 10th, 2008 / Current Affairs, Psychology / 1441CommentsAshamed+To+Share+A+Country...2008-10-10+22%3A42%3A10BlackSun

"Socialism, Communism, go to Russia!" shouts the woman wearing a cross. "He should die," "Socialist Swine," "Terrorist." These are not the epithets of a civilized society. "That guy gets elected, he hangs around with Terrorists!" "He’s a lawyer, we don’t need more lawyers in Washington." "Commie Faggots!" "You killed 50 million babies with abortion!" "Screw Obama!" "European socialist!" "Sleazy scum of the earth."

The videographer asked the man who said "Obama should die," "do you really think Obama should die?" his response, "everyone dies."

Then a rousing drunken-sounding chorus of "God Bless America." Yeeeeeshhh.

I’m ashamed to share a country with these people–no question. The hatred, ignorance, and prejudice is so palpable, it makes me wonder what kind of future we have. Half our population more or less falls in this category. A hundred years ago, it would have been a lynch mob and this crowd would have been picnicking while people were hanged.

Are we doomed to this nonsense every election cycle? Do we really want the future of our country decided this way? Really??

The intelligentsia and technocrats are in a stalemate with the rabble. Then the soccer moms of about 5 states, plus the coal miners of Virginia and a few other small demographic groups break the tie while we fret over hanging chad and electronic voting machines.

Democracy??? You decide. For a nuanced (if slightly apologetic) discussion of the psychology at play, read Jonathan Haidt’s fantastic article on Why People Vote Republican at the Edge.

Last Modified : October 10th, 2008
Filed under : Current Affairs, Psychology
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Comments (1441CommentsAshamed+To+Share+A+Country...2008-10-10+22%3A42%3A10BlackSun)

Bacopa / October 11th, 2008, 9:43 am / #1

These people are the reason I don’t have an Obama sticker on my car. I commute out to work among them. I can’t afford to replace slashed tires, and this video shows I am right to fear people like this.

Bulldada / October 12th, 2008, 1:49 pm / #2

The republicans are exercizing free speech. Democrats choose to victimize children (remember the Cub Scouts bus) and throw bottles of urine at conservatives. Real classy…

H&F: .) / October 12th, 2008, 2:04 pm / #3

Well, like I’ve said, these types r every where to be forund in life! Every bk ground, race, nation - yada yada yada….Fainess isn’t human beings natural quality. I believe the United States is a fanatsy itself, still trying to be real! It really wholly doesn’t exist either. Hey the Mafia hasn’t disappeared ya know! Mean old nasty cranky folks, they r! ^

BlackSun / October 12th, 2008, 2:20 pm / #4

Bulldada,

It’s not the free speech I object to. It’s the lack of rational arguments and the herd mentality. These people are both ignorant and scared. That’s a recipe for breakdown in the social order (mob rule). Politically, it gives rise to what James Howard Kunstler has called “corn-pone Nazis.”

I know I just invoked Godwin’s Law by using the term Nazi. But my point is that the only hope of solving our problems comes through facing them with reason and courage. Hearing an accomplished U.S. Senator and former professor of constitutional law such as Barack Obama referred to as a “Terrorist” or “Muslim” or “Socialist” is unreasonable and absurd and you know it.

This crowd of ignoramuses should know it too.

Happy&Free: .) / October 12th, 2008, 5:22 pm / #5

Yes! Well done response Sean! Very good! Exactly!
They should, but as sick as they r, like the damn Mafia, they r not going to bk down in thier sick, outragous dictorial anger, hate & want for control! That’s why they’ve gravitated to one another! Birds of a feather flock together. Law of human attraction it is! Yuk!
We The people In Order To Form A More Perfect Union! Comes from one Loving & Honoring these words! They don’t even have them in mind! They have other garbage flowing around up in there!

Bulldada / October 12th, 2008, 8:58 pm / #6

Blacksun:

Herd Mentality?

Polls are in Obamas favor. Is the herd finally right this time?

The same herd who gets its news from Entertainment Tonight? The same herd who gets its info from The New York Times? The same herd that is 80% christian? The same herd who thinks Obama is a muslim????

“Democrat” was originally used as a term that meant “A person who panders to the crude and whimsical ideas of the people” i.e. MOB RULE.

So, calling Obama a Terrorist: NOT TRUE. Calling Barak a Muslim NOT TRUE. Calling Obama a Socialist? True as a mother fucker.

Blacksun: admit it. Obamas ideas are socialist as hell.

Get this: People everday THREATEN me with Barak. they say, “You just wait! When Obama is the president you will pay!”

They also say, “If Obama is not elected, their will be RACE RIOTS!”.

Have fun with your new president.

BlackSun / October 12th, 2008, 9:20 pm / #7

Bulldada,

Polls are in Obamas favor. Is the herd finally right this time?

The people on the sidewalk in the video are a herd. They reinforce each other, and they are anti-intellectual. That was my point.

If Obama gets in, it won’t be for rational reasons. It will be because enough people have finally decided to throw the bastards (Republicans) out because they feel like they made a mess of the economy (true or not).

Blacksun: admit it. Obamas ideas are socialist as hell.

It is the height of irony that you label Obama a socialist mere days after President Bush rammed through $700 billion in corporate socialism. (also known as crybaby capitalism–privatize gains, externalize losses) I guess it’s only socialism to you if it helps the little people.

I’m not backing Obama for his social programs, but I am hoping he will bring rational discourse to the subjects of energy, economics and the environment. And he’s not a Christo-fascist like Palin.

Get this: People everday THREATEN me with Barak. they say, “You just wait! When Obama is the president you will pay!”

They also say, “If Obama is not elected, their will be RACE RIOTS!”.

Have fun with your new president.

When did I ever claim that Democrats were perfect or not subject to hyperbole?

Bulldada / October 13th, 2008, 3:29 am / #8

The point is that you are “ashamed to share a country ” with peoples whos ideas are diffrent than yours. The people in the video- are idiots. But why are you not “ashamed to share a country” with the people who throw urine and shit bombs, spit upon US troops returning from war, claim GW Bush bombed the WTC towers etc. etc.

And G Bush passing the 700 billion bailout was a horrible thing. Thats one thing I’ll never understand about the democrats: George Bush took away more freedom than anyother president, increased federal spending by 5x and doubld the size of the fed. He is a liberals wettest dream! And they say they hate him!

YAAB / October 13th, 2008, 6:34 am / #9

I’m glad to see that McCain is dampening these sentiments by clarifying the distinction between a decent, family man and (gasp) an A-RAB. (Yes, this is sarcasm.)

AmenAS/H&F: .) / October 13th, 2008, 8:19 am / #10

UNITED states of america - hmm, nope, still doesn’t exist. A fantasy, wish, hope, a dream yet to come true!
Born & raised in Chicago, Ill my first 11 yrs & the year I left was the yr the first Black Mayor was probably going to be elected. I spent most of the year before I left, hearing every one argue about this. Me & my best friend also argued about who we would vote for, if we could. She supported who her grandma supported & I my mother. She for the white guy, I for the black man. The whole city was focused on the one argument having to do w/ the fact, that if Harold Washinhton gets voted Mayor, alot of the neighborhoods were going to be swormed in w/ blacks from the West & South sides, the ghetto nieghborhoods of Chicago. After I left, I didn’t return to my nieghborhood till 2 yrs later. Everything I heard was true. The arguments made came true. My nieghborhood changed for the worst! Shootings at 2, 3, 4 in the morning! Never, when I was growing up there, the 11 yrs that I did, were there shootings period. Fences 7ft high were put up during the time I was gone! And my best friend of course told me so!! I learned something big about America in this expeience. Gave me something Big to think about & look into! History, social behavior, psychology. Our hearts! Our minds! Our beings! But most of all Fear!
I still would have voted for the black man if I was 18, even knowing what I learned happened, after he was voted in. It wouldn’t have made a difference, the neighborhoods still would have turned out the way they did. Other types of social responses would have come to pass, because of how broken the spirit of the black person is, in poverty, in this nation!
McCain’s temper is Not something I take lightly! And many U.S. veterans don’t support him! Many of us r sick of this War ! My son only has 20 min of gym 3x a wk, because the funding to his school only allows for that amount of time! School lunches r below the quality of tast than the food served in hospitals! This War is based on FEAR! Not ligitamacy! Otherwise all this energy & blood could have been used in providing protection to Darfur, Rowanda & all the other nations who needed America’s love, protection & support !! Do I sound hystericly afraid of terroists? NO! because terrorists r reponding to U.S. policy that they would like changed! They blame us for thier unhappiness! They r mental & emotional disturbed individuals that so many people want to just get rid of by killing them off! Not realistic!!!! Easy to ask others to make that kind of sacrifice going over seas & killing for those who wanted this! I didn’t ask any soldier to kill for me & my son, leaving us vulnerable to the enemy, pissing them off even more!! How stupid this stragedy has been!!!! The Mother of atheism, so to speak, was murdered by an atheist because she was not carefull w/ her tone, words, attitude, mouth! The story of King Arthur lends the dangers of the mistakes when an enemy comes to close & what happens when one doesn’t show proper judgment. Sun tsu teaches be close to ur friends but closer to ur enemies! Blowing up & shooting down these types of enemies, only leaves our children vulneable, NOT PROTECTED!
America is named after an explorer & map maker, this nation isn’t United & humans r humans till the daily news shows other wise! Man, every year canidates in thier own party don’t even agree!
Theist or atheist, no matter what, humans live in illusion & fantasy. Hoping, dreaming, waiting for the fruits of many generations’ labor for peace & unity. Till then we take advantage of this set up called a Democracy in a Republic, to live as sensibly as many of us can. Mental & emotional issues are evidently apparent in the above group! Anyone in thier right & sane mind can see that! I hope they realize, wake up & see the help they desperatly need ! This whole Nation & planet is a mental case! More R & R, balanced wk hrs & a better education for our kids is what everyone needs! Not A War!!

David Vaughn / October 13th, 2008, 3:40 pm / #11

Sean,
It should be no surprise to anyone with a smattering of reading in the humanities that democracy tends to degrade into mutually antagonistic camps of mob mentality. The Bill of Rights, the ideals of brotherhood and religious tolerance upon which the sentiment of national identity began to emerge, although sadly not to flourish, in this nation’s founding have provided a hedge against the full realization of this degradation. But as the poulace grows increasingly alienated from its connection with the rest of society and the world as a whole, its purchase of ideological hysteria also grows. The average man has to believe something and so he chooses according to his present understanding, but invariably he chooses only what he can understand presently. Sarah Palin is the face of Republican populism, the Andy Jackson of the 21st century. McCain may lose, but we’ll be stuck with Sarah via her apologists in the media for quite some time. These people are not going to grow smarter or more circumspect over night, and tireless efforts to persuade them to seek treatment for hypertension may ultimately prove futile. Wait long enough and they will eventually wall off their compounds so they don’t have to deal with the rest of us anymore. Until that time, however, it is advisable to learn both pronunciations of the word “shibboleth” and when you should use them to avoid having your head severed from your shoulders.

libhomo / October 13th, 2008, 7:02 pm / #12

Is anyone really suprised by the hateful and bigoted nature of McCain/Palin supporters? The GOP is a racist/sexist/heterosexist/AIDSphobic/Christian supremacist hate group. People should have realized that by now.

BlackSun / October 13th, 2008, 7:39 pm / #13

But why are you not “ashamed to share a country” with the people who throw urine and shit bombs, spit upon US troops returning from war, claim GW Bush bombed the WTC towers etc. etc.

Bulldada, who says I’m not? I’m ashamed of anyone who abuses the political process with irrational arguments. I’m ashamed of anyone who would throw human waste at someone they disagreed with.

Sometimes its about choosing the lesser of evils, though I wouldn’t necessarily call Obama an evil. But for example, I wish he would stop pandering to religion. I respect that he knows what it takes to get elected, and his policies are much closer to the center on the environment, taxes, and diplomacy. He’s very much like Clinton in that regard–who presided over the longest peacetime boom in U.S. history, where we had a surplus and were paying down the deficit for the first time in 30 years.

“Clinton presided over the longest period of peace-time economic expansion in American history, which included a balanced budget and a reported federal surplus.[6][7] Based on Congressional accounting rules, at the end of his presidency Clinton reported a surplus of $559 billion.”

“Clinton left office with an approval rating at 65%, the highest end of office rating of any President since World War II.[12]“

I expect the same of an Obama presidency–someone rational, responsive, and engaged. Hopefully he will get a chance to prove it.

The average man has to believe something and so he chooses according to his present understanding, but invariably he chooses only what he can understand presently.

David, very true! And well said.

In the end, whoever gets elected will be inheriting a mess, which might not be humanly possible to clean up in 4 years.

Fpnrepublican / October 14th, 2008, 2:50 am / #14

It was truely surprising to see the youtube video on your site. This video is nothing more than a cheap shot. The link below is genuine and tells what you really are saying.

https://donate.barackobama.com/page/content/splashsignup_welcome

Bulldada / October 14th, 2008, 4:51 am / #15

Libhomo says: “Is anyone really suprised by the hateful and bigoted nature of McCain/Palin supporters? The GOP is a racist/sexist/heterosexist/AIDSphobic/Christian supremacist hate group. People should have realized that by now. ”

Wrong. I am a Palin/McCain supporter (in that order) an I am neither of those things. On the other hand the leading Democrat contender, Barak Obama has gone to a black theology (black supremacy) church for 20 years, then quit when it wasn’t politically expedient. He has continually played the race card in his canidacy, along with the media, who also says if you call Obama “skinny” your racist, call him a “community organizer” your racist, disagree with his marxist ideology, your racist.

As for the GOP being sexist? Sarah Palin is running for VP. They must secretly want to finger bang her! Get real…

George Bush has the most diverse staff of any president. Colin Powell, Condaleesa Rice etc. etc. So, racist?

Libhomo: What your saying is prejudiced and you are stereotyping. It’s as if I were to say, “all democrats are freedom hating, homosexual, abortion eaters”.

Bulldada / October 14th, 2008, 4:56 am / #16

“Clinton presided over the longest period of peace-time economic expansion in American history, which included a balanced budget and a reported federal surplus.[6][7] Based on Congressional accounting rules, at the end of his presidency Clinton reported a surplus of $559 billion.”

A republican led congress didn’t allow him to spend all the money he wanted to.

Clinton was also impeached for perjury.

BlackSun / October 14th, 2008, 7:30 am / #17

I am a Palin/McCain supporter (in that order) an I am neither of those things.

But actually you are, Bulldada, because those are the policies Palin/McCain support. It’s well known they want to overturn Roe v. Wade, among other things. And they’re certainly not going to support gay marriage. McCain has no problem trampling on any freedoms or rights he considers “un-American.”

If it weren’t for their social conservatism and their support for the oil industry, I wouldn’t really have a problem with them being elected. I don’t feel they (at least McCain) would otherwise ruin the country.

McCain is patriotic and clearly qualified to be President, (though I strongly disagree with him), but Palin doesn’t have the skills or knowledge by a long shot. Even you have to admit that. Seriously. She’s also a religious extremist.

It’s a measure of your objectivity if you can see the good in your opponent. I would just like to hear you acknowledge for once that Obama is qualified, and sincerely loves his country. It’s OK to disagree with his policies, but don’t use guilt-by-association or broad character smears. It brands you closer to the ignorant mob.

Did you read the “Why People Vote Republican” article? Do you think that authority/respect, ingroup/loyalty, and purity/sanctity are values worth defending?

darkeros / October 14th, 2008, 12:07 pm / #18

Thanks for the link, Blacksun. Unfortunately, some of the other commenters are not interested in an intelligent dialogue. They are just as rabid as the people we see on the screen. I know nothing about who threw piss & shit on returning troops from Iraq. Were these people going into an Obama rally? were they the voters? or some extreme radicals that have nothing to do with Obama’s platform and his own deeply felt personal and political support for the troops. These rabble rousers in this clip pronounce the very same postulates as McCain and Palin, which is why large numbers of their own Republican party have outspokenly stated they will not vote for McCain and instead are voting for Obama. There you go. Most of these expressed attitudes have nothing to do with what the true Republican party stands for, which has been hijacked far too long by the Christian fundamentalists.

One consolation I have is that the majority of the individuals we see in this video are senior citizens. And yes, sir, we do all die. And… these archaic backward viewpoints stemming from ignorant small-minded individuals are in their dying process. The fact is that no matter those who rail against it… evolution of consciousness is happening… and the old and their political/religious systems are dying… rapidly.

It was only a moment ago women were not allowed to vote and interracial marriage was illegal. Attitudes such as these McCain/Palin supporters espouse will in very short order be our next phantoms of the past.

Bulldada / October 14th, 2008, 6:16 pm / #19

“It’s well known they want to overturn Roe v. Wade, among other things. And they’re certainly not going to support gay marriage.”

I will assume Blacksun, that you understand that overturning Roe vs. Wade does not mean a ban on abortion, it just means that abortion rights go back to the states. As well it should. If you don’t want to live in a state that offers tax funded abortions, DON’T. If you don’t want to live in a state that outlaws abortion, DON’T. As of now, it’s a (relatively) free country and you are free to travel wherever you want, right?

Also, in the last debate Barak Obama and John McCain BOTH said they DO NOT SUPPORT GAY MARRIAGE. So, there goes that argument….

“If it weren’t for their social conservatism and their support for the oil industry…”

This is absurd. John McCain is one of the most Liberal Senators out there. Thats why highly Conservative people had such a problem with him. That is why Conservatives were so excited to have a real Conservative -Sarah Palin- on the ticket.

Sarah Palin, on the other hand, took on the oil industries and made sure that they paid up to the Alaskans. They all get a check in the mail every month from Big Oil (and for the record, I think that policy is BS).

There goes that argument too.

“Palin doesn’t have the skills or knowledge by a long shot. Even you have to admit that. Seriously. She’s also a religious extremist. ”

Palin is running for VP. Please don’t quote the “one heartbeat away” line. That phrase is as annoying as, “thats not change we can believe in. That’s more of the same!” And Sarah Palin is NO MORE A RELIGIOUS EXTREMIST than Barak Obama. NO MORE. She may disagree with you that killing babies is wrong (as do I. As an Atheist, I think life is more important than anyting. Afterall, it is all we have.), and her “must teach creationism in government schools” has been thoroughly debunked.

“I would just like to hear you acknowledge for once that Obama is qualified, and sincerely loves his country. ”

Obama is not qualified. Maybe he will be one day. And I do not believe he loves his country. I believe he, maybe like you, “is ashamed to share a country” with anyone who does not share his opinion.

And to darkeros: Blah blah blah, talking points, talking points, blah blah blah. Come back when you have a real defense…

AmenAS/H&F: .) / October 15th, 2008, 9:47 am / #20

Okey. I said w/ my friends as a child & still do to this day. If we could, why don’t we have two Presidents? One to rep the majority vote the other for the minority vote. Having one President isn’t realistic anyway. The population has more than doubled since this government was established & the way we differ, the poeple need better international representation. Isn’t that what the Presidency really is? The International Representative of this Nation. The President of the United States of America doesn’t have all the power. So why does the individual hold this office alone? What is the purpose & historical significance of it being held alone?! I think this office needs more chks & balances having the runner up as his vice pres, like it was once upon a time. We should be voting for the President & Vicepresident seperatly.
I’m sure like any other politician, Obama at some point would change his mind about gay marriage, he’s being safe, whats new! Obama is no divine hero for me. Just a better rep w/ his claims for the next four yrs. He still has to prove himself, if & when he gets into office! Really, I don’t think & have ever thought one President is enough for this Nation. The system is old & out of date!
I have never met anyone ever convince an other that who they r voting for is the wrong choice! No one has ever in my life said ” Hey man, I’ve been thinking about what we’ve been discusing all year long & ur right! U’ve convinced me to vote for ur man! Ok bud ! let’s vote together for the other canidate !
THAT’LL BE THE DAY THIS HAPPENS!!!! Men!!!

AmenAS/H&F: .) / October 15th, 2008, 9:53 am / #21

And Fear is part of the mob mentality! No one could take that from my long & none reponsive comment?! Sorry for not writting & thinking like the rest of u. I am my own person.

BlackSun / October 15th, 2008, 10:06 am / #22

Bulldada,

Even when you talk about the issues, you’re twisting the truth. Take Roe v. Wade, putting the decision back in the hands of the states is the same as banning abortion for those who live in those states. Blue states don’t need the protection of the supreme court, and so there’s no worry, for example, that California where I live will ban it. But its precisely in the red states where the protection of a national right to choose is necessary, so narrow local religious attitudes cannot prevail. Whether you or I are personally against abortion is not the issue. It should be a decision left up to the woman, and that’s what Sarah Palin doesn’t understand. So she’s no champion of women’s rights.

The diversity in Bush’s cabinet is immaterial. It’s his policies and reliance on his “gut” that I object to. He has sidelined nearly every recommendation from government science panels, intimidated witnesses from testifying on climate change, ignored intelligence briefings from his own departments, and generally carried on like a bible-thumping moron. “I’m the decider” is an insane way to run a country, doesn’t matter what color or sex your advisers are if you don’t listen to them.

As for oil drilling, it’s a matter of approach and priority. McCain/Palin pay lip service to alternatives, but it’s no secret where their hearts stand. Obama pays lip service to drilling, but he would solve climate change and switch over the entire economy to green-tech–which is coming anyway whether you like it or not. Banks are already starting to require carbon impact calculations when they make loans for large utility projects. Do you want America to be ahead of the curve? Or playing catch-up like we did when the Japanese kicked our asses building small cars in the ’70s?

Same on gay marriage. Palin has to say she supports gay equality, even though she doesn’t. Biden has to say he opposes gay marriage, though I’m sure he supports it personally.

You need to look beyond rhetoric, to see what’s actually in the fiber of the candidate. And I’m still waiting for you to acknowledge the good in Obama, and that he’s not just qualified, but well-qualified. Otherwise you expose yourself as a blatant partisan and uncritical thinker. This man taught constitutional law, for crying out loud.

I have said it several times, and you keep ignoring it: It is the tone of the attacks, the blatant distortions, death threats and sneering smears of the Republicans in the video I’m objecting to. People are free to have an honest disagreement. But when they grossly distort their opponent’s position and carry on like a lynch-mob, I am indeed ashamed to share a country with them.

Stop distorting my position, and respond to what I actually said. Or you’re just like them.

H&F: .) / October 15th, 2008, 5:42 pm / #23

I think bulldada is an old foegy. Like the poor old scared folks in the footage above, he can only support, as David put it, what he can understand presently.
Well bulldada, I share an agreement w/ u on abortion being a killing of our offspring but would never support making it illigal, especially reversing it ! I know for a fact many women r abusing their right to have an abortion, using it as birthcontrol. How this is possible, is beyond me, being it cost’s $300-400 ! I’ve met guys who’ve had relationships w/ women who get pregnant on purpose, get the man to pay for one each time they end up pregnant or don’t care about using birth control because they can get one. And who have had 6-8 abortions in 15 yrs of thier life. Wonder if their even telling the truth & have a sickness of some sort.
Sexuality still needs to be addressed in this narrow sighted & minded nation of ours! Abortion is an unfortunate reality that sickens me but men will be men & women aswell. But also because of our historical ways of being brought up about sex, our bodies, nature etc. A women left to bear a child that she cannot take care of, is an appalling reality in this modern age!! So what is one to do when the only avenue for some women is this choice. I am an all most aborted child, that is why I got the name after the God of Life, Amen-Ra. But I know women for centuries have always found ways to rid of their pregnancy. So making it illigal doesn’t stop what was historicly already happening for such a long time w/ the local Witch doctor or Medicine man.
Teaching sexual responsibility is such an important need in our nation. It’s mind boggoling how much concervatives r in the middle of keeping this from appropriatly happening! So bulldada, why don’t u get a degree in sexual reproductive health & guide the next generation in how they can make responsible & commited descisions on their sexuality & reproductive power? I am. I love this number sex It’s old latin for the no six. It fits, being thats where our reproductive organs r located, at six o’clock.
Something to think about for those who think it’s ok to reverse Roe v Wade.
As for the old crazy folks on top. I bet if I was able to interview many of these individuals behaving as they did, they all would have had taumatic childhoods, misconceptions on black people from childhood, experiences that have made them the way they’ve turned out. It would really shed light on the fact that people who behave in such a way, find each other, not by chance but thru the fact of the matter it takes humility to admit first one has issues & one needs to address them, because if one doesn’t, they become these folks, untereated for psychological problems, yelling ridiculous things in public & not thinking one thing of it! Like the Nazi’s killing off the Jews. Did they think anything of it? Some I’m sure, others just went on as if nothing happened. These folks r scary old people! From a time of hate, superority & white supremacy. I don’t see one Black, Asian, or Latino person among them.
I would like to add I’m voting only for historical reasons this election. Obama has sincerly convinced me he has productive solutions & plans for our environment, the Iraq situation, education, tax resolutions etc. McCains temper leaves us vulnerable! Last time I voted was for Kerry & shocked this Nation voted for boo boo head Bush! : I>’ I wonder what it would be like now if Gore had been elected in 2000? I do believe the whole Florida incident gave Bush the win. Other wise Gore would have been President. It was an undemocratic solution on what was allowed to come to pass, because tired wking Americans weren’t paying attention to the ballots still being used in Florida. Curious if Skull n Bones had anything to do w/ the Florida situation? Hmmm….the other Mafia, innocent University society / club my foot! Traditional poverty rooted mafias & the upper class educated ones! Democracy in a Republic, in our dreams, hopes, fantasies & realistic efforts to materialize. May the best Man win!

Bulldada / October 16th, 2008, 6:26 pm / #24

“Take Roe v. Wade, putting the decision back in the hands of the states is the same as banning abortion for those who live in those states.”

Blacksun, here we will just have to disagree. I think that the most demoratic way to deal with any issue, is to allow the states to decide. The Feds should not have the authority to wish its whims on all Americans. Abortion included. And anyway, why is abortion even an issue? All women are free to choose, and I think that choice begins as soon as she opens her legs without any protection. (As do the democrats)

“Whether you or I are personally against abortion is not the issue. It should be a decision left up to the woman, and that’s what Sarah Palin doesn’t understand. So she’s no champion of women’s rights.”

Typical rhetoric… Because Sarah is opposed to abortion, she’s no real woman? Sorry, abortion is NOT the only issue. As iv’e said previously, the same thing happened to Justice C. Thomas. Democrats said “he’s no champion of black rights!” Apparently, you can’t be a “legit” black man, unless you are a victim, and you can’t be for “womens rights” unless your for killing babies…

“The diversity in Bush’s cabinet is immaterial”

Quit calling G.W. Bush a racist if this is “immaterial”.

“As for oil drilling, it’s a matter of approach and priority”

Global warming, or “climate change” (as it’s now called since the earth is “cooling” because of the “warming”) is a fraud. Look at the other side of the argument, Blacksun. It’s a doomsday hoax that sells.

“You need to look beyond rhetoric, to see what’s actually in the fiber of the candidate”

Like, “change”, “change we can believe in”, “got hope”, “four more years of Bush”, “Bushs failed economic policies” etc. etc. etc.?

“Otherwise you expose yourself as a blatant partisan and uncritical thinker.”

Once again, because I don’t agree (per say) with you on all issues I must be a dumb-ass.

“But when they grossly distort their opponent’s position and carry on like a lynch-mob, I am indeed ashamed to share a country with them”

You still are ignoring all the crazy shit Democrats do. Check out some alternative news sources and you may see that both radical republicans and democrats are doing this stuff. And if you want to be fair on your blog, show both sides….

“Stop distorting my position, and respond to what I actually said. Or you’re just like them.”

I think I adressed your points, but I have a feeling you’ll still be prejudiced enough to say I’m “still just like them”.

BlackSun / October 16th, 2008, 7:01 pm / #25

Blacksun, here we will just have to disagree. I think that the most demoratic way to deal with any issue, is to allow the states to decide.

Should the states be able to eliminate the Bill of Rights?

“States rights” arguments have always been spurious. They date back to the slavery issue, and nearly always represent someone trying to enforce a viewpoint that would lose if put to a national vote.

Because Sarah is opposed to abortion, she’s no real woman?

Still distorting what I said. Straw man #1: I said she was “not a supporter of women’s RIGHTS.”

I think that choice begins as soon as she opens her legs without any protection.

Nature has programmed us to reproduce. Not everyone who is capable of reproducing is responsible enough to overcome their instincts. Not everyone responsible enough to want to overcome their instincts and use protection has easy access to contraception or proper sex education, thanks to years of “abstinence only” conservative religious policy. You know better than that! If you want to reduce abortions, flood the schools and clinics with free contraceptives. If you oppose that solution, AND want to outlaw abortion, then you’re a rank hypocrite.

Quit calling G.W. Bush a racist

And the parade of straw men continues. Straw man #2, never said it. G.W. Bush may be a lot of things, but I would not call him a racist.

Once again, because I don’t agree (per say) with you on all issues I must be a dumb-ass.

Straw man #3. I said “if you can’t see the good in your opponent, you expose yourself as a partisan and non-critical thinker.” About 3 posts ago, I told you what was good about McCain. Can you do the same about Obama? I’m waiting.

You still are ignoring all the crazy shit Democrats do.

Straw man #4. I said about 3 posts ago that I disagreed with and condemned Democrats who do crazy shit.

and if you want to be fair on your blog, show both sides….

I never said I would always show both sides. But I will attempt to back up anything I say with evidence, and am willing to be shown where I’ve gone wrong.

H&F: .) / October 16th, 2008, 10:06 pm / #26

Uh! Really bulldada! U must not have made love to alot of women in ur life time to know that protection isn’t enough?! What about rape?!
I want to clarify that I agree w/ contraception as part of reproductive health education! As well as psychology or psychological counseling! Depression, loneliness has SO MUCH to do w/ alot of pregnancies!
Anyone opposing contraception in schools & wanting to outlaw abortion is NUTS !
Bulldada ur position is such a danger for a civilisation & it’s future. The human mind & body functions as it does differently for everyone. Choice doesn’t begin when a women opens her legs! Choice begins when a person is free from feelings & ideas going thru thier minds & hearts that enslave them to actions they later realise had to do w/ lack of love or care from whom ever raised them! Choice depends on a persons state of mind & emotional development! Ur interpretation of human behavior is too simplistic! The evidence on abstinance is as bright as the sun itself ! How u can not feel anything for the babies who didn’t ask to be here entering the world in homes unprepared for them, is heartless to me! A baby in a black garbage bag here in Maryland was found resently still alive in the cold woods behind a gas station & she was still but hardly breathing! For a human being to dispose of a baby that way just shows me how religion, education, government & the advancements in science has failed ! Humans r not any different than animals in behavior! People r too busy in life to know whats really going on in our society’s minds in this area & w/ all the damn comercials, there r n’t enough of ones letting women know they can drop babies off at hospitals w/ out fear of being arrested or charged!!!!! Comdemnation never heals, it takes compassion, understanding & sympathy to the reality that kids need affection & when they don’t get it, they r going to look for it thru physical intamacy! And they will do it w/ or w/ out a condom or birthcontrol pills in order to get that intamacy! It’s about understand the accuracy of our worlds behavior & implementing the proper actions to them! Fear rules so many individuals decisions in life, it’s sad we haven’t learned to stop intimidating everyone w/ rules & laws! Fear, Money & a hearless woman is the key factor to why that baby was left to die in a black bag in the woods on a very cold night! And people like u made it possible!!!!!

bulldada / October 17th, 2008, 5:59 pm / #27

Is there really nothing more to the people of this forum than the topic of abortion?

Blacksun: Of almost all the points iv’e made you focus on one thing: aborting babies.

Look, I don’t care at all about abortion. Why? Because I am a guy. And since woman claim it’s a “womans right” I should not care at all, and neither should any men. Any woman who says shes for abortion, that it is her right, and wants a man to grant it to her, is no real feminist (according to yours and your readers apparent logic). As the great Tim Leary said (here goes that evil conservative quoting his ilk again) “women who seek equality, lack ambition”

What about the other issues? Or should I just vote Obama because he is pro-abortion? What about the 95% of americans taxes will be lowered lie? What about the lowering of capital gains taxes on buisness lie?

This article is about how you are “ashamed to share a country” with the people in the video. Me too. I’m also ashamed to share a country with people who have no respect for soldiers, theologians, democrats or republicans.

I however, do not hide my disrespect and contempt for people who are either uneducated enough to vote Obama, or will do so because he panders to class warfare.

Obamas platform is on class warfare, socialistic ideology, redistributing wealth and as he says “spreading the wealth around”.

Sorry, but as a free man I do not believe someone has the right to my money and especially the time I put into making it.

Obama supporters on the other hand, do think they have a right to someone elses earnings, money and time.

I will side for freedom everyday. Barak Obama is athreat to everyones freedom.

Louis / October 17th, 2008, 7:59 pm / #28

Wow Bulldada, I see what you did there.

You are the critical thinking master!

Sorry, but as a free man I do not believe someone has the right to my money and especially the time I put into making it.

Uh, you pay taxes now, and if McCain is elected, you will pay taxes.

Anyway, you are an epic fail on seeing anything good in Obama. COLOSSAL FAIL!

3 things I like about McCain:

- Conviction. He will stand behind what he believes even when it conflicts with his own party line. That shows a feisty character and a degree of backbone needed for politics.

- Experience. 26 years in the politics scene. He is seasoned.

- Not a right extremist. I am a political centralist, so this is actually a bonus considering how far right some conservatives go.

That said, McCain (and specifically the combination of McCain/Palin) doesn’t embody enough to win me over.

That is all Sean asked you for, and you failed to deliver.

Instead you come off as someone whose head is fully baked. Critical thinker, my ass. Be glad this isn’t my house, because you’d already be gone.

And now for some levity…

Click around on this page for some giggles!

Happy&Free: .) / October 17th, 2008, 11:35 pm / #29

buldada,
It’s been me who focused on it, Sean didn’t.
So if Bush was going against McCain ud still vote for him? Why is socialism such a bad word? The word social is it’s source. And what’s w/ all this McCarthy ant-Communism, Socialism nonsense? Communism doesn’t exsist! Never happened! So called Communistic Nations DON’T practice Marxism, Communism or Socialism for that matter! They practice dictatorship under the guise of such a system that humans don’t even have the capability of cooperativly ever accomplishing!
Wking people do 40 hr wk wks. Many European friends tell me Americans wk too much! French have 30 hr wk wks & 1-2hr breaks! This also includes Arabs who make these comments. Austrailians, Morraccans, Norwegians aswell. It’s the Donald Trumps & Wall Street folks Obama’s referring to, NOT wking class America! Come on!
Well the cops found the woman who left her baby in the black bag. She didn’t speak any English & said she didn’t know about Maryland’s Safe Haven Law. She is 25.

bulldada / October 18th, 2008, 6:41 am / #30

Alright. Why it’s so important for me to say something positive about Obama to you guys, I don’t understand, but here goes:

1. He is more handsome than John McCain.

Thats all I can think of.

Happy&Free: .) / October 18th, 2008, 11:07 am / #31

I can assure u bulldada that if u were in a situation in which u needed saving or help & Obama happened to the person near by to be that help, ud have alot more positive things to say. And most definatly Obama wouldn’t be thinking about whether u approved of him or not. He’s human, a good person & if he’s not & has some stuff up his sleeve, it’ll all come out in time. In the mean time McCain & Obama r the choices & everyone talks like they know better & would do better! So gentlemen (including the one’s who commented in “Be a Catalyst”) why don’t u all get ready for the nxt election and RUN?!
So bulldada, if Bush & McCain were running against each other u would still vote for Mcy?

BlackSun / October 18th, 2008, 11:47 am / #32

Bulldada,

Well, that’s progress. My whole point here was to separate personal feelings from issues. And also to talk about a candidate’s actual position, rather than a whole host of straw men erected and knocked down primarily in disgust.

Whether it’s cries of “Socialist” or throwing human waste, it detracts from understanding of what the real issues are.

And clearly what separates us are the issues, so if we are ever to reach understanding, it’s important to get to the heart of what it is we actually disagree about. And I’m sorry, sometimes when I get passionate, I may also fall prey to name-calling. Nobody’s perfect.

Don’t know if you ever read the link about “Why people vote republican” in the original post. Basically, there’s a huge emphasis in the Republican mind on a morality based on authority/purity/sanctity/belonging. Those tendencies may have a positive side in social cohesion. But they also can produce monolithic thinking and knee-jerk resistance to change. There’s nothing quite like the sheer panic that sets in when Republicans fear the social order is about to be upended.

For example, look at Prop. 8 in California. The radio spot goes like this “They’re trying to ram gay marriage down your throat–whether you like it or not.” Actually, the court decision that allowed gay marriage in California only affected gay people. Straight marriages were completely left alone. But the social order has been upended, and the religious right is freaking out.

Liberals mostly care about harm/care/fairness/reciprocity. That is what separates us, it’s clear conservatives also care about those things, but they rank the order of importance differently. If we understand each other and allow that the other has sincere motives, we get a lot further than those people on the sidewalk or the shit throwers. That was and is my whole point.

bulldada / October 18th, 2008, 3:40 pm / #33

And my whole point is this:

I will err on the side of Freedom on every issue, every time.

And after weighing the odds, McCain is more supportive of freedom, economic and otherwise, than B. Obama.

“Whether it’s cries of “Socialist” or throwing human waste, it detracts from understanding of what the real issues are.”

Obama said to Joe the Plumber; “I want to spread the wealth around”. When a government official says things like this, it screams socialism. And socialism does not work.

Don’t know if you ever read the link about “Why people vote republican” in the original post.

Yes I did. And for alot of it, I find it absolutely correct. But ya know, people like Michael Savage have written scholarly things about liberals that I found to be true too. What seperates republicans and libertarians from democrats and socialists, is that the former two regard the individual to be more important, whereas the latter are all about the group.

Extremists on both sides do a disservice to their cause.

Happy&Free: .) / October 18th, 2008, 4:10 pm / #34

So serious So serious! Hmmm… in a low gruffy tone. So America’s capitalism wks better?! Nothing in life wks by itself everything has to have a little bit of everything in order to wk. Socialism is part of life no matter what one thinks of it or tries to do to avoid it. As I’ve been explained The U.S Fire dept wk thru socialistic economics - Volenteers & Donations. No fed or State funding goes to them. Correct me if i’ve been misinformed or maybe it’s this way for only some states.
Socialism is part of life, it’s part of natural economics, it’s not a economic choice. I don’t believe it’s in our power to do away w/.

BlackSun / October 19th, 2008, 1:15 pm / #35

Bulldada,

There’s two axes in the political divide, social and economic. You seem like both a social and economic conservative, tending toward libertarian on the economic side. You say on the one hand you err on the side of freedom every time, yet you support candidates who will not protect minority rights of people whom they disagree with.

There’s an interesting politics test at okcupid. It’s pretty long, but useful in determining where you stand. I came out as a “Paleo-Liberal,” which gives me a higher score on personal freedom than economic freedom, where I come out right smack-dab in the middle.

You scored 77% Personal Liberty and 54% Economic Liberty! A paleo-liberal believes in low to moderate government intervention on personal matters and moderate government intervention on economic matters. They tend to be opposed to war, police powers and victimless crimes. They believe in a social safety net, but to a lesser extent then most leftists. They generally believe in protecting personal liberty. They support self-ownership and privacy. Some Paleo-liberals may lean towards embracing capitalism as an economic system. Paleo-liberals are reminiscent of the attitude of the “new left” of the 60’s and 70’s. Strong Paleo-Liberals border on Libertarianism.

To elaborate a bit more, I’m for a balance between private economic rights and the public interest. For the record, I’m against progressive taxation. I think everyone should pay the same tax rate regardless of income level. I’m strongly against double-taxation of any kind, including on corporate dividends and on inheritance.

For a safety net, there should be a minimum subsistence-level income which is guaranteed (set just at or slightly above the poverty line). Above that, everyone should pay a flat-tax, which rate is established automatically by computer algorithm to reflect a balanced budget for that year. If the tax rates get too high, then the only mechanism to lower them would be to slash programs. No deficit spending of any kind should be allowed, and an amendment to this affect should be added to the national constitution.

Budget priorities should be set by expert committees and computerized economic modeling–also codified in the constitution. No politicking allowed. Results are set in the models for long-term stability, growth, trade, and an emphasis on prosperity, education, and continuous self-improvement of citizens. Externalities (unpaid costs incurred in economic transactions) should be minimized to the greatest extent possible, which argues for true-cost pricing on natural resources, and payment for waste disposal/pollution included in pricing of goods and services.

People in general are not smart enough to know what are wise economic decisions. Putting those questions before an ignorant electorate is a prescription for people voting themselves more and more money from the public treasury, and voting politicians in who are perfectly willing to run up $50 trillion of national debt. The proof is in the pudding.

Bulldada, I’d really be interested to see the results of your politics test.

bulldada / October 19th, 2008, 2:20 pm / #36

Blacksun:

Thanks for the link. That was a long test. Heres my results:

Libertarian
You scored 73% Personal Liberty and 77% Economic Liberty!

A libertarian believes in little to moderate government intervention on both personal and economic matters. They generally believe in a government that is small and limited to the extent of protecting people’s liberty. They tend to be opposed to war, police powers, victimless crimes, foreign intervention and what they consider to be a welfare state. They support both property rights and self-ownership. More moderate libertarians may use a more utilitarian or gradualist approach, while the more heavily minimalist libertarians allow less room for compromise in a direction that they consider to be away from liberty. Libertarians generally support capitalism as an economic system. Libertarian thought tends to be individualist in nature.

And I agree with you about the 60,000 pages of tax code being too much. Have you ever looked into the fair tax?

BlackSun / October 19th, 2008, 2:50 pm / #37

Bulldada,

Very interesting. We agree almost exactly on personal liberty, and differ only by 23% on economic liberty.

Yet we both got caught up in sloganeering. I’m wondering if McCain/Palin’s clear agenda against personal liberty doesn’t scare you a bit? I understand why Obama’s economic plans go against your principles. But it seems he’s closer to your ideas about personal freedom. And as far as taxation goes, we’re talking about very small differences. Obama says he wants to “spread the wealth around.” But there is no wealth to spread. Only debt. The truth is, if we want to balance the budget, we are going to have to both cut programs and raise taxes, no matter what either candidate says. Just watch what happens no matter who gets elected. We are in for tax increases, period.

For me, Obama is the lesser of evils because of his moderate stance on social issues. I also see him being transformational on the international stage. McCain could reinvent the image of the US if he does it right, but I have serious concerns because of his strong military bias.

But if our economic system goes into rapid collapse or hyperinflation, social concerns will drop to the bottom of the pile.

bulldada / October 19th, 2008, 3:45 pm / #38

For me, social concerns have already dropped in importance at the same rate as my 401k. For me, this election is about the economy. I’m out alot of money and if my taxes go any higher, i’ll be up that well known river.

My job and the people of my communities jobs are on the line because of enviromental hysteria (regarding snowmobiles in Yellowstone). So, enviromental concerns have taken a back seat, too.

I have a brother in Afghanistan who is fighting for my right (and yours) to sit around in air conditioning and bitch back and forth about who the next talking head will be. His first day in Baghdad (during his first tour) was Christmas day. He was travelling to base in a humvee with another humvee in front of him. The first one ran over a land mine. Killed all 5 in it. The medic in his vehicle stepped out to help. When he did, he stepped on a land mine. Killed everyone except my little brother in that vehicle. I thought that experience would change his views on the war. It did not. He changed mine when he told me that he would gladly die for the Iraqis if it meant a chance for them to experience a little bit of the freedom he grew up with.

Alot of people will laugh that comment off as “military brainwashing” or “his job, he signed up for it”. To those people, I have nothing but pity and contempt for. But I digress. The war on terror must be fought. And we must win. In my opinion, McCain would handle the war better.

As far as taxes go, the best way to jump start the economy of course is to put more money in the hands of people who will spend it. Even Democrats in congress agree, that’s why the want a second Economic Stimulus Package. Eliminating or reducing Capital Gains Taxes, Death taxes, Inheritence taxes, corporate taxes, income taxes etc. would do the same thing: put money in the hands of the people. In my opinion, the latter would be much more effective. And it has been proven over and over that raising certain taxes reduces revenue to the government. Barry Obama agrees, but says he will raise them for fairness.

Again, check out fairtax.org. This may be the right way to fix this economic SNAFU.

BlackSun / October 19th, 2008, 4:19 pm / #39

My job and the people of my communities jobs are on the line because of enviromental hysteria (regarding snowmobiles in Yellowstone). So, enviromental concerns have taken a back seat, too.

Funny enough, I agree with you about the local environmental concerns. I see these battles as less relevant than the global drive for sustainability. Bottom line, make people pay for the natural capital they are using. We have a lot of waste. We could live better with less waste and pollution within a few short years with a few small policy changes. It would help the economy too.

And I think environmentalists would be better served to focus less on symbolism, (snowmobiles in the park) and more on total ecosystem management, allowing for human enjoyment where possible, and a balance between competing uses. This is provided that users of natural systems are required to pay for or mitigate their impacts. Kind of like the old adage on the hiking trail: “leave it as good or better than you found it.”

Happy&Free: .) / October 19th, 2008, 6:12 pm / #40

bulldada,
Iraqi’s & Afghanistanian’s can fight THIER OWN FIGHT to tast the freedom they so dream of!! Ur brother leaves me & my son vulnerable to hysterical mentaliy deprressed Jihad fanatics!!!! Ur brother isn’t fighting for me, my son & anyyone else who feels the same way!!! He’s fighting for the damn Conservative propaganda Christian’s have been putting out there for so long!
This propaganda was in my head growing up so very strongly! And when I realised this, I didn’t go bk to my recruiter to finish signing the papers to enter the Marins!! A soldier as a citizen doesn’t have the liberty to pick & choose which Battels they want to accomplish or participate in! That’s NOT FREEDOM BUT ENSLAVEMENT !!! As a citizen of these United States I should be able to decide which Battels I believe in or not!!! Espesially if I sign up to serv in the Military !!!!!! So many things even in this Nation is ancient in practice!

Happy&Free: .) / October 19th, 2008, 6:27 pm / #41

Though I don’t expect a response, but just in case. Please don’t & to anyone else, come bk saying so is sex ! ; ) I refer to ancient govermental practices that should be done away with, that hinder True Freedom & Liberty!
P.S. If I entered the Marins, I would have been court marshalled for refusing to engage any & all orders after 2001! I made the absolute right decision not to serv an out of date Military!

Louis / October 20th, 2008, 2:02 pm / #42

Here is my score:

Centrist

You scored 57% Personal Liberty and 43% Economic Liberty!

A centrist believes in moderate government intervention in both personal and economic matters. They tend to be somewhat ambiguous, as they may have the opportunity to pick the side of any group surrounding them on any given issue. They generally believe in a moderate social safety net and what they consider to be a balanced stance on personal liberty. Centrists tend to emphasize compromise and cooperation between partisan groups.

…

That is one of the better online tests I’ve seen, and pretty much bang on. There were only about 5 of the questions where I was feeling none of the options fit as the context of the question was a little odd. I could have answered both agree/disagree, but that wasn’t an option. That definitely skewed my result a tad. 43% Economic should be just over 50%. Otherwise decent test!

What is odd for me is the fact that of all the Republican candidates, Ron Paul is whom I would have preferred to see in a first string position. He is uber Libertarian.

Of the Democratic candidates, Obama wasn’t my first pick either.

Depending on how the test is formated I usually tend to fall decidedly onto the Libertarian (but never extreme) side of the spectrum and hold onto the center of the left - right with a grip of death.

bulldada / October 20th, 2008, 6:04 pm / #43

Blacksun: You say:

“…make people pay for the natural capital they are using.”

My question is who owns this capital? And who do they pay it too?

And to Happy & Free: You say: “Though I don’t expect a response…”

Happy&Free: .) / October 20th, 2008, 6:16 pm / #44

bulldada,
Ur a constapated old man!!!!!!! Of course ud even repond the way u did! In ur grumpy old way! ; )

H&F: .) / October 20th, 2008, 9:33 pm / #45

Hey! That test was fun! Did the test w/ my neighbor over the phone, he & I agreed on all the answers, so he pretty muched scored the same.
My scores: 68% personal liberty / 48% economic
Same as u Sean! I’m a Paleo Libertarian too! Not surprised! Everyone notices my views r hippie like, but not entirely. Thks for that link! Sharing it w/ others!

bulldada / October 21st, 2008, 5:58 pm / #46

Happy & free:

I don’t respond to your comments because I suspect you are a child with access to a parents computer. Lets go through the list of “insults” in just this forum:

I think bulldada is an old foegy

U must not have made love to alot of women in ur life time to know that protection isn’t enough?!

Bulldada ur position is such a danger for a civilisation & it’s future.

…baby was left to die in a black bag in the woods on a very cold night! And people like u made it possible!!!!!

Ur interpretation of human behavior is too simplistic!

Ur a constapated old man!!!!!!! Of course ud even repond the way u did! In ur grumpy old way! ; )

Happy & free: you are an embarrasment to the free thinking, civil and intellegent people on this website. Go back to your People, US and Star magazines and let the adults talk.

H&F: .) / October 21st, 2008, 10:42 pm / #47

Dear bulldad,
I play since some conversing here at BSJ gets so seriously stuffy! I don’t consider ur interpretation to maturity whole heartedly applying to ur self aswell. U too come off silly & that is what I have been reflecting! U started the insults buldada, so I just thru ur own garbage bk to u! Ur mean & not nice. And everyone shouldn’t have to act or respond as u feel necessary. I communicate creativly as I so choose. That is my choice. I will not conform to adult stuffy ways at all times because u or anyone else criticise me for not doing so! If u can just be the mature man u claim u r, having the opinion that u have of me & find what I say irrelavent, u shouldn’t be so bothered! We r all child like, that child likeness that is part of ourselves never leaves us. Ur upsetness or offense of my comments prove this about ourselves as humans. Ur criticism, condescending attitude & annoyance of me is rediculous. If u feel that way, stop reading my comments! U don’t like what I have to say, don’t read them!
Peace & Love! Really!
It takes more mucseles to produce a frown than a Smile! = ) & one keeps thier youthfullness dong so! I promise to not bug u as long as u don’t bug me to! Okeydokey?!
Bye Bye ! So long! Farewell! Adios! Arivaderci! Caio!

bulldada / October 23rd, 2008, 5:24 pm / #48

Since it is largely believed (on this website anyway) that conservatives are violent, racist, hate mongering, evil, vile, rancid, disgusting, violent, blood thirsty and hateful people, based on ONE video, try this news article on for size:

A 20-year-old woman who was robbed at an ATM in Bloomfield was also maimed by her attacker, apparently because of her political views, police said.

According to WTAE’s news exchange partners the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review Ashley Todd, of College Station, Texas, was using an ATM at Liberty Avenue and Pearl Street in Bloomfield just before 9 p.m. on Wednesday when a man approached her and put a knife to her throat.

Police spokeswoman Diane Richard said the robber took $60 from Todd, then became angry when he saw a McCain bumper sticker on the victim’s car. The attacker then punched and kicked the victim, before using the knife to scratch the letter “B” into her face, Richard said.

Now, alot of republicans will use this story to explain the hateful and evil ways of the democrats, just as the story Blacksun posted was used to explain the hateful ways of the republicans. Fact is, idiots are everywhere. Especially at campaign rallys, protests and voting booths.

Happy&Free: .) / October 23rd, 2008, 10:42 pm / #49

Logged on BSJ earlier to see if any one had written on this incident yet! No one had, so waited till some one did. My 60 something friend & her husband r voting McCain/Palin. I called her to correct the version she had shared w/ me & to let her on a decision I’ve had to make that will disappoint many of u, but truly thrill bullldada. I am grateful for the correct version & to have been able to share it w/ my 60 something friend (Left it for someone else to put on BSJ who knew how to use those “thingys” under the comment part. They never wk for me when I try to use them!)
Like I too said, these people r found every where! This man might have been black & as a white woman & the lack of decency already being displayed by this “mugger”, not surprised. As I grew up in Chicago & saw how things unfolded during elections for the first possible black Mayor of that City. And the first black Mayor, Harold Washington, was elected. It was a tough time for Chicago in the area of racial crimes & the degredation of many areas of the city w/ the inflood of ghetto residents who felt the need to bring their issues further out into the City of Chicago. My 60 something friend just called & finished telling me, many think/feel if Obama doesn’t win, there will be riots to McCain/Palin’s winning!
I am looking forward to how Obama is going to address this crime committed against this
innocent young woman. Like the first commentor above said “These people r the reason why I don’t have an Obama sticker on my car”.
Well Obama’s been throwing around short intense conservative rhetoric here in Va, in his recently advertised campaign comercials to win this states conservative vote! Va hasn’t voted Democrate since LBJ (1960’s)! He lost my vote saying in his commercial that “Criminals deserve to be punished for their crimes”! I don’t believe in punishment ! Criminals need to be repremanded & discilplined for thier crimes & rehabilatated for if & when they re enter society! I have very strong feelings towards these issues simply because what I’ve personaly seen in life & in a big city such as Chicago & DC, my self being a victim of sex molestation repeatedly by one male perpatrator or another thru my yrs growing up in Chicago. And my Mom’s rape when she took a short cut at 14, she told her perpatrator she was a virgin, so his response was “Okey, let’s do it the other way!” Criminals do not get the message being punished! They get the message when Diciplined & repremanded for their crimes! Correctional Rehabilitation in a boot camp like setting would be far more effective than what our Nations So Called Correctional Facilities have provided for too long!
Sorry Obama voters, he has lost my vote! I’m doing a protest vote! I’m confident most Americans r voting for Obama! ! ! So he’s going to win w/ out my vote any ways. If I could get to Obama about this issue, maybe I could get him to re think his use of words on this serious problem in our Nation, that needs improvement ! ! ! Prisons r n’t getting smaller & more r being built !
For most of u logging on this site - Yeah! Obama 08!
For me Peace & Love to Planet Earth! ! !
The Office of Presidency is not my Priority. It’s the betterment of Humanity & I don’t need goverment to get it done! I need my Human Brothers & Sisters to join together to accomplish the necessary goals to making this Planet A More Perfect Union! I’m not interested in the US of A’s continued intent of being a Super Power!
I’m interested about our Planet & her Inhabitants Living Happy & Free!
Happy voting to everyone this upcoming Nov 4th!
And I wish for the young woman all the Peace & Recovery she deserves from this traumatic horrible crime committed against her by a very horrendously unhappy & angery man.

BlackSun / October 24th, 2008, 3:37 pm / #50

Bulldada, she made up the attack. This is rich. Desperation time.

If it actually happened it would be despicable, of course.

bulldada / October 24th, 2008, 5:41 pm / #51

Yup, it was made up. Proves my point, that crazy people are on both sides of any argument. For instance, the whole “kill him” thing that McCain supporters were yelling, turned out to be just as false as this crazy bitches story.

Happy&Free: .) / October 25th, 2008, 3:10 am / #52

First of all she’s a human being! Not a Bitch! Get ur species straightened out! She obviousl;y has a serious issue that needs to be appropriatly taken care of & prison ISN’T THE ANSWER! So if Obama or McCain get elected, issues such as the prison issues in this Nation remain the same! Jails get bigger, individuals like the woman in this incident don’t get the help they need & life for the financially well off prosper. While Israel gets millions of dollars & spoiled Americans continue to whine like babies about the economy they created, supported & nurtured & U.S. childern r still below average in math & science statisticly against the world! Let alone all the depression & stress they go thru! No wonder they’re suicidal half the time, addicted to drugs, alcohol, sex & prescription drugs! And what kind of adults do they turn out to be?! People who desperatly seek God, Organised Religion, psychiatric and psychological help (psychiatrists & psychologists who still don’t know what to do for emotionaly & psychologicaly distraught individuals seeking to be saved / helped from their confusion or disturbed state!). And all thanks to who?! THE FREAKIN ADULT ARROGANT WORLD, WHO THEMSELVES HAVEN’T GROWN UP ENOUGH TO HAVE THE RIGHT TO RULE THE WORLD THE WAY THEY DO!!!!!!!
No Matter what, It’s A Dictatorship! And I can confidently say the hell to Government !! I no longer want to be a part of this Illusion of Human Adult Creation! Because No Matter What, Who ever Wins, It’s Going To Continue to Be a Messed Up U.S.of A.! Fear Is what Keep Humans Stuck In their Ruts! Not Bush, Bush’s Father, Clinton, Nixon, Reagan or The Next Future President of These (Not) United States, Have been or Going To Be The Reason Behind any Problematic Issues in this Nation! It All Falls Upon We The People of the U.S. of A.! There R Four Branches of Government (not 3!) - The People Who Vote (the 1st Branch), then the Three Branches Who R Voted in By The First Branch! The 1st Branch decides, When they vote, they R Not Capable of Being Leaders of Their Lives, So they Vote for Scapegoates to Blame and Whine about when things go wrong!
There is No Time for Clubbing, Rock Concerts, Dinning, Expensive Elaborate Parties etc While the Men & Women U all Put in Positions of Authority Over Ur Lives, Decide Ur & Ur Children’s Fate & Future! REAL ADULTS DON’T HAVE TIME TO PLAY - PLAT TIME IS FOR CHILDREN or WITH CHILDREN!
Governments Have Risen and All Have Failed Equally! There is No Guerantee this Nation Will Last Longer Than Rome Did! If this Nation fell tomorrow, What would u all do?! Stick around & continue to complain?! Or take Immediate Action because ur lives Depended on it?! Voting isn’t Everything that Makes for a Nation. It takes Unity! And this Nation is Not United! Wake up and Really get Involved In Ur Nations Future, Stop Complaining!
Government isn’t any different than Organised Religion! It’s all the Same Lies & Nonsense!
And that’s THE TRUTH whether u like it or Not!

Orion77 / October 27th, 2008, 3:19 am / #53

Bulldada,

You claim early on, in your rants here, that Obama’s ideas are socialist and therefore he is a socialist. I don’t think you even understand what the term means. You parrot this ignorant politically contrived slur, like a devoted young Hitlerjugend singling out Jews for special treatment.

And, I’ll bet my right-wing arse, you’ve never left the good old US of A & visited the “socialist” hell holes of Europe, Japan, Australia, or New Zealand, where as one example, universal health care is considered a fundamental right for all citizens, rich or poor. How can it be socialist, for a government to spend the voters taxes, delivering free medical treatment, to the people it serves? Oh yeah thats right, you believe it because Republican politicians, acting on behalf of Medical Services Corporations, keep telling you it is so, in your best interests, of course.

You are an ignoranant buffoon, a true gift to advertising agencies, political shysters & religious conmen alike. They need you, so stay stupid!

bulldada / October 28th, 2008, 4:45 am / #54

Orion77:

I understand what socialism is. And Barak Obamas ideas for this country are socialist.

And it looks like youve lost your “right-wing arse”. I lived in Europe for 5 years. Health care there is rationed out. In fact, in the UK because the hospitals are so full, they now give doctors bonuses for NOT sending people to the hospital. They also have privatized health care for doctors and nurses because they want them to get better faster. The US has the best health care system, because it’s private, because it allows for competition. Furthermore, name one government institution that the government has been successful in? Why would you trust these people with your life and health?

Health Care is not a right. I understand you need someone to take care of you. I however am an independent being. My body, money, health, car and guns belong to me. I belong to myself. Who do you belong to? Or, rather, who do you want to belong to? On Nov. 4th when you cast your vote you’ll decide. Vote Barak, you willingly belong to the Government.

jim coufal / October 31st, 2008, 1:40 pm / #55

It got tiresome reading the my “mine is bigger than yours” comments, so unfortunately that seem more and more to fill humanist/atheist blogs. But here are couple of thoughts based on the many responses I did read.

1. My son has lived in Alaska 13 years. He received oil royalty checks long before Palin.

2. About American car manufacturers, when the Japanese autos captured the market there was a saying, “American manufacturers hired more lawyers, the Japanese more engineers>” Do we ever learn? In a free market, caitalist system shouldn’t the American auto companies be allowed to go belly-up, or are there more consideraions, like social ones?

3. If global climate change is a hoax, it is second only to the hoax of religions.

4. If because I’m a guy (an old one at that), and should’nt be concerned with women’s rights, hoe far do we take that concept? I’m no longer a child so I shouldn’t be concerned with cildre’s rights? Not an animal, so… Not a cancer patient or a diabetic, so…?

These conversations are fun to read (within limits!) but I suggest the have little impact beyond catharsis for the writers.

Cynical Jim

AmenAS/H&F: .) / November 1st, 2008, 10:25 pm / #56

Had to jump in and say Amina/Jeanne from France had nothing but possitive things to say about France’s medical care. And knowing other Europeans I’ve never heard complaints about their health care. America’s health care needs impovement and that’s all there is to it. It’s not good enough. I’m not a person to settle for mediocre or stagnation. Progress is part of living every day. Failing to change America’s Health care because it’s doesn’t need to is a lie & therefore a direction to death, deterioration & a falure to progress, not a direction to & for Life.

Al / November 29th, 2008, 8:48 pm / #57

Kinda late, but wow, Obama actually won the popular AND the electoral vote - is GW jealous? Also, I know people who live in Norway, a socialist country. They laugh at insinuations that socialism is evil - they are very happy over there, contrary to the masses of Americans struggling these days. The Republican party will continue to erode until they can prove that they can think and evolve. Extinction may happen before that happens. How are you Sean!?

BlackSun / December 1st, 2008, 8:36 am / #58

Al,

I’m good. It’s interesting how buzzwords like “socialism” can get people to stop thinking. There are two trends in government that I see that are hopefully unstoppable:

1) A reduction in tolerance for trampling of minority rights. This can be seen in narrowing margins for bigoted ballot measures such as California’s Prop. 8, as well as greater support for global action to prevent crimes against humanity such as genocide.

2) A recognition that how the most vulnerable in society are treated reflects on the ethics of the whole society. Call this socialism if you will. Another part to this shift is the understanding that we must assign fractional externalities to those responsible. In plain English that means costs such as pollution, CO2, and replacing non-renewable resources (any cost incurred to someone who is not party to a transaction) are rolled into the costs of the products we buy.

These two titanic shifts in consciousness are being resisted by those who refuse to think of humanity and the earth as an interconnected whole.

Now, within this framework, paradoxically, if it is administered properly, we should be able to have the most individual freedom. Sometimes it takes a structure to set us free.

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